The Aussie Fires and why all the media hype is starting to piss me off.

[Lovelee]

It would help if owners were allowed to cut down trees around their properties to create firebreaks.
But the greenies dont want that. If the greenies were ignored by all governements the planet would be much better of and fewer people would be killed by fires.

Absolutely.
That is a well known problem, and one not confined to Australia either.
Once regular burnoffs removed the debris from the forest floor, preventing major bushfires.  Also had the effect of removing vermin too.
In the interests of their green philosohy, environmentalists have campaigned tirelessly against this practice of removing the fuel that  bushfires feed on.  I suppose it would be too much to hope, that they were amongst those who lost everything? 
Probably.  Most of these so-called envronmentalists live in the cities, far from any of the problems they cause.

Thats about the biggest load of rubbish Ive read!!  You obviously dont understand the uniqueness of these bush fires in OZ, you think you do, but you are missing the obvious.

Cut down trees??  Which ones??  Just those around the houses??  Or maybe youd like to see the forests removed??



Lets look for instance at the pic above of a small part of Kingslake - you will see many of the trees are untouched - the fire hasnt moved on in via the grass either - you can see that most of that is also untouched.  These houses were destroyed by fireballs of embers blowing in on the galeforce winds, these houses burnt to trash in minutes.

Most of the 400,000 odd hectares of burnt land is bushland - Aussie Forest - you want that all taken down also??

Aussie has a history of cutting down everything - take a look at any map of OZ and you can see the benefit of their slash to grow food.  There is less than 5% of OZ that has greenery on it.  The centre is desert - which is salt bush in the main and as you look towards the east coast the more recently stripped areas, deliberately done for food has left the area with no soil base - its blown away - all there is for hundreds of miles is sand - the food bowl is no more.

[wgtngirl]

We are still waiting to hear if a young teenage friend of my older kids and her family have survived.  No-one has heard from them for about a week and there is no response to their cellphones.  I sincerely hope they are safe but it is looking more likely that they aren't.

[Lovelee]

Its that waiting that makes it difficult Wellie.  I think you can leave your details and your friends details with the police here and they check it out for you, might take a few days though. 

One of the reasons they arnt letting others into the areas is that its all been labeled a crime scene, so bodies cant be moved until the cops have done their detailed checks.  Theres talk of one of the towns having bodies in the street last night and they had to move them b4 letting the residents in.

[relaxed1]

Welly we will keep our fingers crossed fo them...

[DazzaMc]

...and toes....

[k1w14ever]

welly, there is a 1800 number if you e-mail me I can try and find out for you if you like.  I will need all the info you have. Nmaes etc.   I cannot promise however.  There is sill hundreds of people missing.

I could not even imagin what friends and family are going through not knowing.

It is my optus e-mail

[k1w14ever]

This is the first time my daughter has understood such a disarter(sp).  The thing she is finding hard to believe is why would people start these fires.

[Lovelee]

Its important to to point out to her that less than half of them were started by arsonists 

Dry lightning mostly started the rest.

Yeh Kiwi - I get the feeling we dont yet know of the full horror that awaits those clearing the houses.

[guest49]

Cut down trees??  Which ones??  Just those around the houses??  Or maybe youd like to see the forests removed??

WTF?
Who mentioned cutting down trees?
Dont spout rubbish!

Bushfires are a natural phenomonom in Australia.  Some of the eucalypts even require them.  The Stringybark, for instance.  Fires used to go through regularly, cleaning out the undergrowth and forest floor debris.  This prevented what we are now seeing, where environmentalists swoop on anyone foolish enough to clear debris from the forest floor.
And yes, you have posted a pretty picture of the tree tops.  What does the forest floor look like?

Please engage brain before mouth!

[DazzaMc]

"where environmentalists swoop on anyone foolish enough to clear debris from the forest floor" - any TRUE environmentalists would be encouraging these fires. They are, after all, a natural and required event for that ecosystem...

[guest49]

The very point I am making Dazza. 
On reflection, I probably should have used the term "greenie" rather than environmentalist.  However, most people would get the point, I'm sure.

[Lovelee]

Cut down trees??  Which ones??  Just those around the houses??  Or maybe youd like to see the forests removed??

WTF?
Who mentioned cutting down trees?

Blod stated it and you endorsed it.

[Calliope]

Given that so many of the trees remained untouched, what is it about the houses that made them burn so readily and why were they not "fireproofed"

[guest49]

So he did.  And I agree with him.  I am sure he wasnt advocating levelling every tree in Australia, just those surrounding a house.

It is very similar to the greenies here squealing with rage at the thought of clearing trees away from power lines.
In the same vein, I'll bet they wernt amongst those who were without power and snowbound for three weeks last year, because of the snow laden trees that snapped and collapsed over miles of line.

[Megan Au]

Shame they didnt have a swimming pool they could have jumped in?

The swimming pool would have become a saucepan of boiling water ..........Flames didn't need to touch the cars to kill it's passengers

[Megan Au]

It would help if owners were allowed to cut down trees around their properties to create firebreaks.
But the greenies dont want that. If the greenies were ignored by all governements the planet would be much better of and fewer people would be killed by fires.

Absolutely.
That is a well known problem, and one not confined to Australia either.
Once regular burnoffs removed the debris from the forest floor, preventing major bushfires.  Also had the effect of removing vermin too.
In the interests of their green philosohy, environmentalists have campaigned tirelessly against this practice of removing the fuel that  bushfires feed on.  I suppose it would be too much to hope, that they were amongst those who lost everything? 
Probably.  Most of these so-called envronmentalists live in the cities, far from any of the problems they cause.

Thats about the biggest load of rubbish Ive read!!  You obviously dont understand the uniqueness of these bush fires in OZ, you think you do, but you are missing the obvious.

Cut down trees??  Which ones??  Just those around the houses??  Or maybe youd like to see the forests removed??



Lets look for instance at the pic above of a small part of Kingslake - you will see many of the trees are untouched - the fire hasnt moved on in via the grass either - you can see that most of that is also untouched.  These houses were destroyed by fireballs of embers blowing in on the galeforce winds, these houses burnt to trash in minutes.

Most of the 400,000 odd hectares of burnt land is bushland - Aussie Forest - you want that all taken down also??

Aussie has a history of cutting down everything - take a look at any map of OZ and you can see the benefit of their slash to grow food.  There is less than 5% of OZ that has greenery on it.  The centre is desert - which is salt bush in the main and as you look towards the east coast the more recently stripped areas, deliberately done for food has left the area with no soil base - its blown away - all there is for hundreds of miles is sand - the food bowl is no more.

You have the patience of a saint Lovelee

[Megan Au]

Lol... you cant just roll on into an eviroment and chop-n-change and then expect the enviroment to remain the same!!!

What they SHOULD be doing is lighting new fires every year. That and monitoring it better.

I don't think you appreciate our climate and bush ..........This is how many bush fires have started in the past , controlled burns getting out of control once the winds change .....the better way is to make firebreaks using front end loaders etc

[Megan Au]

Given that so many of the trees remained untouched, what is it about the houses that made them burn so readily and why were they not "fireproofed"

They were , most of them were built with fire retardent material , had sprinkler systems fitted into the roofs and firebreaks around the property .........The trees were not 'untouched '

[Calliope]

I was referring to the comments in the above picture
"Lets look for instance at the pic above of a small part of Kingslake - you will see many of the trees are untouched - the fire hasnt moved on in via the grass either - you can see that most of that is also untouched.  These houses were destroyed by fireballs of embers blowing in on the galeforce winds, these houses burnt to trash in minutes."

[guest49]

Something to fill in a few idle moments Lovelee
http://www.griffith.edu.au/conference/bushfire2006/pdf/a-spatial-decision-support-system.pdf

[Lovelee]

Given that so many of the trees remained untouched, what is it about the houses that made them burn so readily and why were they not "fireproofed"

These houses were destroyed by fireballs of embers blowing in on the galeforce winds, these houses burnt to trash in minutes.

[Lovelee]

Something to fill in a few idle moments Lovelee
http://www.griffith.edu.au/conference/bushfire2006/pdf/a-spatial-decision-support-system.pdf

wont open for me.

[DazzaMc]

I don't think you appreciate our climate and bush ..........

lol... no comment....

This is how many bush fires have started in the past , controlled burns getting out of control once the winds change .....the better way is to make firebreaks using front end loaders etc

No - now you are talking about people moving in and setting up shop in a location which depends on these fires for it's very existence - and then having the humans 'control' nature.

Perhaps... just perhaps all these deaths are the fault of the humans and not the bush or climate?
Humans are trying to populate an area where fires are more than just 'common' - perhaps the human should consider this before moving there...


Light the fires yearly.
If a house or three gets burnt, then so be it - so long the people and their stock are OK.
These fires are natural and required - clear felling the place will only create other issues, such as dust storms and top-soil depletion.

If you chose to live there then you chose to live WITHIN the environment, not on top of it.

[Calliope]

 POLICE are investigating reports of two arsonists lighting fires near the township of Stanley in Victoria's north, not far from the Beechworth firefront.

Victoria Police Chief Commissioner Christine Nixon today confirmed the probe into reports of two small deliberately-lit fires late on Tuesday which were quickly extinguished.

"We did have some information and we are investigating that,'' Ms Nixon said.

 "It was in the north of the state.''

It is believed police have a description of a car used by the alleged arsonists.

The Beechworth bushfire has burnt out 30,000ha, but the threat from it has eased.

Victorian Premier John Brumby said words escaped him when describing those responsible for deliberately lighting fires.

He said he was aware of several fires being deliberately lit in the Beechworth area overnight.

"There seems little doubt that these were deliberately lit," he told reporters at Longwarry today.

"I think words escape us all when it comes to describing that deliberate arson.

"All we can now do, with a police team, in place is to detect those who are responsible, to charge them and to let justice run its course."

Mr Brumby urged anyone who saw suspicious behaviour to notify police immediately.

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,27574,25039598-29277,00.html

[DazzaMc]

Burn them alive - live on TV (WAY after kiddies bed times) for all other fire-bugs to see.

Eye for an eye.
That's the only justice they deserve.


It's time they got hard.