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Finned friends


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Author Topic: Finned friends  (Read 823 times)
ssweetpea
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« on: April 01, 2009, 03:58:16 pm »

I have been having aquarium troubles this week.

First nemo got a fungus on his fins again. In with the dye, only this time instead of recovering he died after just two days. When burying him I noticed blood streaks on his tail. Oh, septicemia, I thought.

Then Dory got fin rot and the odd blood streak in his tail but was still swimming around normally.

I found the PH testing kit which I hadn't used for ages and tested the water. Acid.

I changed out 3/4 of the water. All was OK for a day then Dory went to the bottom with fins clamped and excess mucus membrane. The water was acidic again.

Another water change, just the usual tank this time. All was well for a few hours then back to clamped fins excess mucus again. Both fish had stopped eating by this time and Dory was gasping but not at the surface.

Off to the aquarium shop I go to get something to raise the PH. The owner reckons that the problem is the gravel so I dug out half the gravel (more dirt in it than I suspected), removed the plants and put a prescribed amount of PH raising agent in.

Patch the other gold fish is now fine, no longer gasping. Dory however is on his side allot of the time, when he isn't dashing madly around the tank. I mean madly. Bashing into the sides etc. Still gasping but the blood streaks have nearly completely gone. The water is still returning to a PH of 6.6  and Patch was constantly annoying Dory and triggering more insane swimming so Dory is now in the quarantine tank half filled with fresh water and half aquarium water. He is on his side much of the time, still gasping and still swimming around madly every few minutes. I have covered the quarantine tank to try and keep him calm.

Do I empty out the entire aquarium to get rid of the remaining dirt and gravel?
Will Dory recover from the acidosis or do I call it quits with him?
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dragontamer
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« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2009, 05:26:02 pm »

When in doubt, Melafix.

How big is the tank?  What filtration do you have?  Is there fluoride etc to contend with?  Do you have a gravel cleaner?

I've only got tropicals inside now.  All my goldies are out in the pond.  Including a big, white oranda.  She's quite well balanced so I'm of two minds whether to leave her out there for the winter, or to bring her in.
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« Reply #2 on: April 01, 2009, 08:02:44 pm »

Yes, I run an underwater filter with a sponge media. The tank is 24" x 12" and the water is 10" deep. yes, the water is fluridated and chlorinated so I add stresscoat to remove the chlorimine.

I do have a gravel cleaner, the basic siphon type that cleans the gravel while sucking out the water. That is why the amount of dirt surprised me. However we did have a sudden warm spell after a cool period and even through the sun doesn't get anywhere near the tank the water was warmer than tap water. The filter clogged in only a fortnight when normally I rinse out the sponge every six weeks, there was more evaporation than usual as well. Back up to summer levels and more algee.

I forgot to mention that I had added melafix to the tank as well as the dye but I stopped when Dory started acting weird. I have been putting in stress coat and I add aquarium salts everytime I replace siphoned out water, 1 tsp per 10 litres.

My quarrentine tank is a little 35cm x 25cm x 25cm with a cabon filter and airpump.
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« Reply #3 on: April 01, 2009, 08:10:34 pm »

Ive got an outside pond with 3 goldfish at the beach - Pixie, Dixie and Trixie.

I saw them through the murk the other day, I have to clean it when I get back out there.
Poor little buggers have been 12 months without me to scratch their lil tummies and stuff!!

Fungus on the fins??  fin rot??  Shit I hope they dont hear about this!!
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dragontamer
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« Reply #4 on: April 01, 2009, 09:03:27 pm »

Melafix is brilliant.

You can get serious salt creep if you add salt every time.  It builds up in the system. 

Thats a relataively small tank, but I'd be adding a second filter - goldies are dirty little critters.  I have a low circulation filter that cost about $25.  You could go with either the Elite Stingray or a Magic jet filter.  In a smaller tank you don't want to create too much of a current, but you want the water moving.

No carbon while treating - I'm sure you know that, but just reinforcing.  I would fill the bucket(s) with fresh water 24 hours before you need them, and let them stand.  The fluoride and chloride will evaporate.  Don't ask me how it know to do that, but it apparently does.

Don't over clean the filters.  Some try to keep the tanks too clean - thats as bad as, if not worse, too dirty.  A friend of mine has the most disgusting tank yet her fish are thriving - when you can see them through the green gunk. 

Finrot is a bastard to stop.   There is a highly effective treatment and I succeeded using it once, but the stuff isn't something you want in the house with kids (purple crystals - highly toxic - Potassium Permangimate - I had to give it back to the chemist for disposal). 

You could try furan2 from the petshop, but I would also be careful about whats already in there.  Furan is a strong anti-fungal treatment.  I've used that successfully in the past too.  It wasn't as swift as the PP, but a lot safer.
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dragontamer
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« Reply #5 on: April 01, 2009, 09:04:49 pm »

Oh forgot - whatever is on your hands goes in the water.  Soap is bad for them.  So is a lot of other 'normal' products so watch that.
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« Reply #6 on: April 01, 2009, 11:07:01 pm »

Masterpet used to do this antiseptic that was brilliant - hell on biological filters but the fish sure did recover. I first got gold fish for sp1 for her second birthday. The last one of them passed away from cancer 3 years ago which is went we got this trio - now duo and the bigger tank.
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« Reply #7 on: April 02, 2009, 10:53:11 am »

Well Dory looks much improved this morning. his balance is still a little wobbly but he is upright and swimming much more normally. He is still gasping a little but the rate slows down rapidly when he stops swimming. For the first time in nearly a week he is hunting for food.
I gave him a couple of flakes and a skinned baby pea and he ate them straight away.

He is an oddly shaped fish. He is about 4-5 inches long like Patch but were Patch is the typical torpedo comet/shabuchan shape Dory has a much deeper body, twice as deep as Patch. No discernible variety but definitely not a comet.
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« Reply #8 on: April 03, 2009, 11:17:33 am »

hehehe - I still reckon outside must be beat for them - they harden up and learn to cope  Roll Eyes
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Nitpicker1
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« Reply #9 on: April 05, 2009, 09:10:38 am »

Re fluoride and chloride evaporating, chloride does evaporate but fluoride interacts with calcium in the water and becomes calcium fluoride.

Calcium leaches out of aquarium gravel and sand, where it comes in contact with the fluoride, and bingo ya've got xtra problems 'cos most town water supplies are already "hard" with calcium.

To test your gravel for leaching, take a small quantity of the dry gravel, in a glass, fill with white vinegar and watch to see if bubbles fizz out of it. If it does, best to use waterfilter gravel and sand, expensive but should be safe.

Flter through peat to acidify water if your test shows too blue, through charcoal to improve alkalinity if your test is too far on the yellow. Better than making big frequent waterchanges imo 

oops modify: Never wash a sponge filter with hot water, or let it dry out. That kills the wee bugs that help in cleaning the water.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

From about 1945, my stepfather was a commercial breeder of coldwaters and I collected the daphnia and mosquito larvae for his breeders from wild ponds at Opihi, near Timaru.  That is where I first kept whitebait in a tank.

Apart from the 7 years my dear departed and I spent as gypsy lifestylers, until recently I always had some sort of fish as part of the household.

When we retired in '86 I took up tropicals breeding as a hobby and made a bit of pocket money and paid the power bill as a result.  Had 24 tanks of various sizes, started accidentally with neon tetras in a community tank and my crowning glory eventually was to be the first South islander and the second NZedder to raise a brood of Discus. 100 babies first brood = $1000 .

I' on holiday mode for the last 3 weeks, when I get back in the groove I will look out some pics. I did a video diary of bristlenose cats breeding, put it on disc, could make a copy if anyone wanted it .... if I can find it. I think there's one of the Discus too, somewhere.


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dragontamer
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« Reply #10 on: April 05, 2009, 11:24:14 am »

I considered breeding for a short time, but quickly lost interest.  I love my tropical tank and now that I have got the other 4 tanks out of the house, we have space again.  Too many people in my house and crowding was a real problem, especially with the bird cages and other pets.  I might go back to it later once the kids have moved out.   My bristlenoses breed all the time, but the babies never make it past the clown loaches or hoplo's.

A local guy breeds gorgeous black knife fish (I think that's what the call them).  He's funny - he goes into the pet shop and won't talk to either of the senior staff.  He always speaks to my daughter, but not in a creepy way or stalkerish.  I think he likes the fact she is enthusiatic about animals/fish, willing to learn and willing to find out if she doesn't know an answer.

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« Reply #11 on: April 05, 2009, 11:45:35 am »

I have removed all the gravel from the tank for now.

I tried cleaning half of it yesterday in tap water but the amount of algee on some of the stones means I really with have to let it dry out them scrub again and again. I am not sure it is worth the bother. Mr sp and sp3 can bleach it and use it for their model railway and I'll get some new stuff.

Even after all the cleaning the water is still on the acid side when I tested it this morning but the fish are happy so I will keep and eye on it and hold off putting the plants back in for now. It wouldn't surprise me if I now have a bit of new tank syndrome going on but at least not only is Dory behaving normally, as is Patch, the damage to his tail is growing back as well.

Lack of space is the reason I don't have a bigger tank. Anything bigger would require a free standing unit and there is no space for that anywhere in the house unless we get rid of a bookcase, like that is going to happen. We have decided to just stick with the two fish.

Maybe one day that pond we have been thinking abour for 15 years or more will get put in. Unless we win lotto I can't see us moving anytime soon or extending the house for that matter (sorry sp1). Still you never know what might happen.
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« Reply #12 on: September 14, 2009, 05:17:50 pm »

Hello  Cheesy

My fishies got a clean out today.  They live in a paddling pool thingy in the front garden.  There was 3 but now only 2  Sad

I noticed today that they are different and I wonder are they different species or male and female.

They are goldfish, brilliant colour!  But one has a fan tail and the other a up and down one.

Anyone know the difference?

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« Reply #13 on: September 14, 2009, 05:23:42 pm »

Sounds like you have a Fantail and a Comet.
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« Reply #14 on: September 14, 2009, 06:23:46 pm »

Are they attracted to each other sexually?

How do you tell the sex of goldfish?  Grin
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« Reply #15 on: September 14, 2009, 09:37:35 pm »

Yes, they are both goldfish so mating may occur with the possiblity of offspring. Just like different breeds of dogs, cats etc. They are not separate species.

How to tell the sexes appart however is not easy and in allot of cases not possible.

If the fish grow to maturity and get into breeding condition and the pond is not over populated males can have small white spots on their gill plates (not always noticable) and the females are fatter and often bigger.

A full grown goldfish is six inches long, excluding tail.
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« Reply #16 on: September 14, 2009, 10:08:26 pm »

Hmm judging from that, the fantail is female (shes fatter, got a chunky tummy) and the comet is about 5" I reckon excluding tail.   Smiley  Thanks SP.
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« Reply #17 on: November 05, 2009, 06:40:48 pm »

Well Dory looks much improved this morning. his balance is still a little wobbly but he is upright and swimming much more normally. He is still gasping a little but the rate slows down rapidly when he stops swimming. For the first time in nearly a week he is hunting for food.
I gave him a couple of flakes and a skinned baby pea and he ate them straight away.

He is an oddly shaped fish. He is about 4-5 inches long like Patch but were Patch is the typical torpedo comet/shabuchan shape Dory has a much deeper body, twice as deep as Patch. No discernible variety but definitely not a comet.

Remember those water quality problems I was having?

I ended up removing all the gravel and doing partial water changes twice a week to keep Dory's fins and mucus membrane in reasonable shape. Even Patch was suffering. The ammonia levels wee pesistantly high and Ph low.

It finially occured to me last month that the filter wasn't coping with the 2 largish fish.

New larger filter and new gravel and we have two happy more energetic fish with no signs of any problems. Ammonia levels are back to almost none exsistant and Ph is finally at 7. All without a total water change.

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